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“Bill would always remind me that you never know who is watching. And that can be a message for all of us. You might not think that your neighbor is paying attention to some way far out stuff that you're doing in your field, but there's somebody that's watching and hopefully someone will learn and take something good away from watching your good soil health and conservation practices.”

—  Jim Hershey, No-Tiller, President of Pennsylvania No-Till Alliance, Elizabethtown, Pa.

In the latest edition of the No-Till Farmer podcast — brought to you by Yetter Farm Equipment, listen to a discussion about Pennsylvania No-Till Pioneer Bill Cannon. You’ll hear from 4 different people who were heavily influenced by Bill and worked closely with him before his passing.

Those sharing their memories about Bill Cannon during this episode include Jim Hershey, Elizabethtown, Pa., no-tiller and current President of the PA No-Till Alliance, William Thiele, a Butler County, Pa., no-tiller and member of the PA No-Till Alliance board of directors, as well as two staff members with the Mercer County, Pa., Conservation District — Nick Trivelli and Jay Russell.

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Full Transcript

Welcome to the No-Till Farmer Podcast, brought to you by Yetter Farm Equipment. I'm Mackane Vogel, associate editor of No-Till Farmer. In today's episode, listen to a discussion about Pennsylvania no-till pioneer, Bill Cannon. You'll hear from four different people who were heavily influenced by Bill, and worked closely with him before his passing. Those sharing their memories about Bill Cannon during this episode include Jim Hershey, Elizabethtown, Pennsylvania no-tiller, and current president of the PA No-Till Alliance, William Thiele, a Butler County Pennsylvania no-tiller, and member of the PA No-Till Alliance Board of Directors, as well as two staff members with the Mercer County, Pennsylvania Conservation District, Nick Trivelli and Jay Russell. All right, Mackane Vogel here, and today I'm joined by a group of farmers and agriculture folks to talk a little bit about Bill Cannon, no-till pioneer. And so I'll have everybody introduce themselves here and then we'll get into the discussion. So Jim, I'm going to start with you.

Thank you, Mackane. Yeah, Jim Hershey here. I'm from Elizabethtown. We operate a livestock farm, broilers, hogs, and farm about 500 acres. Been no-tilling for 40-some years and cover cropping. Also, I serve as president of the Pennsylvania No-Till Alliance, which Bill was a founding member of. And Bill was a very dedicated individual to the board. He contributed a lot. My memories of Bill would be, I guess, of the first thing that comes to my mind that he was very adamant about trying to get a lot of his neighbors and folks there in Mercer County on board with no-tilling in the early years.

All right. William, why don't we go to you next?

Thanks, Mackane. So my name's William Thiele. I'm a dairy farmer from Butler County, Pennsylvania, which is about an hour or so south of where Bill was located. And how I got to know Bill was I knew Bill before I joined the Pennsylvania No-Till Alliance Board of Directors. I'm actually good friends with his grandson, Sam. And Bill kind of got me a little bit involved with the No-Till Alliance along with his grandson, started attending some events, and he and a few others coaxed me to join the Pennsylvania No-Till Alliance Board. And the thing I remember about Bill the most, I guess, the most fond memories I have of him is that he would always be showing me pictures on his phone and say, "Hey, look what I just did." And he'd have some crazy wacky stuff. I think he made his own roller in front of his planter, which I think was a giant piece of well casing, I think, of some crazy thing like that, that he puts some heavy chains on it and says, "See, I made this to flatten down my cover and plant green through it."

And I'm like, that's very ingenious of Bill to do that. That's just the stuff that he always was thinking of, that he would try to think of something to do it economically that way. And that was one good memory that I had of him. And he always had some stories, especially in the early years of doing his no-till cover cropping and talked about how his neighbors thought he was a little bit nuts. And then he would show them every year that he really wasn't that crazy.

But he was very much a pillar in the community, especially in Mercer County, Pennsylvania. And everybody especially looked up to him for that. And so did myself. I really looked up to him as a friend of mine, so he'll definitely be missed. But yeah, he had a very, very strong impact on the community, that's for sure.

Yeah, thanks for sharing that. Nick, let's hear from you next.

Thanks, Mackane. My name is Nick Trivelli. I am a conservation resource specialist with the Mercer County Conservation District. I'm starting my 10th year now here, and I remember when I first started, part of my job is to help out with education. And Bill was one of the first people that I got to meet, and he was always willing to open up his farm to have soil health days or cover crop demonstrations, or anything like that to help get the word out. He was very, like Jim alluded to, he always wanted to spread the word. He never cared if you were a conventional tillage or no-till, he just wanted to at least bend your ear and get the conversation started. And I always appreciated that about him and the willingness to open up his house and his farm for the local and regional farming community to attend events at his place.

Great. Yeah. And last but not least, Jay, let's hear from you.

Yeah, Jay Russell, I'm the conservation district manager in Mercer County. Been here since 2016. And shortly after I started, Bill called to introduce himself to me and talked to me about the No-Till Alliance. I always remember, he always said, "This is a farmer-led organization." He was very passionate about that farmer-to-farmer message of the alliance. And I remember the first contact, he made sure I knew that. So being from the conservation, we're an agency within the local government, but at the same time, he was willing to talk to me about what they did, and very passionate about that. That was the start too. Bill and I had many years of, luckily enough to get to know him better, a lot of the stories William and Nick have told are very familiar to me. So definitely something that Bill made an impact in our life for the conservation in Mercer County for agriculture.

And correct me if I'm wrong, this could be anybody, feel free to chime in, but he was primarily soybeans and corn, I think maybe had some dairy background prior to that. Is that right?

I've known him always as a rotational crop, but I do believe if Jim, if you may know, or Jay, did he have dairy prior?

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Bill and his family, actually, they had a milk processing or a jugging operation there for a number of years on their farm and they sold whole milk right out of the farm there for a number of years. And then I think without putting any date on it, I think that probably ended there in early 2000 maybe.

What would you guys say, just to paint the listeners a picture, what made Bill tick? Was it the soil health aspect of it or was it more of that farmer to farmer learning kind of thing? What was really his true passion in the agriculture world?

I think you could describe... I mean, Bill was E, all of the above. He was always passionate about the soil and how it was alive. I was talking about the critters in the soil and how could we get somebody to speak to a group of people without getting into the biochemistry of everything and all the processes, and not to say dumb it down, but to get so everybody can come out with the big picture of what's going on in that soil. And then you never saw a man more proud of his cover crops. And one thing that kind of always stuck with me for whatever reason, he would always throw a little bit of sunflower seed in his cover crop mix, just because it made people happy when they drove by. Said, there's got to be some benefit, but also the benefits in that person that's driving by on a nice day and could see a bunch of sunflowers. So it was all encompassing with Bill.

I'd say too, that even though he was a very early pioneer of no-tilling and cover cropping, he was always wanting to learn more and he was wanting to hear what other pioneers out there were doing. It was not uncommon for Bill to call me up some evening and just wanted affirmation on something that he was going to try. It might've been something with a cover crop mix. Did you ever try rolling vetch or what challenges might I have when I start using multi-species cover crops, and what can I expect? Well, and so then it would lead into, well, what kind of planter attachments do I have on my planter? And so he was always wanting to learn, but for the northwestern part of the state, where Bill was located, well, Nick and Jay, you know, have more challenges there than what maybe we have here in the east.

Yeah, my experience with Bill was that part of trying to get more people in the county at first, to try and be exposed to no-till, how to get that word out to them. I think that's why one of the reasons he used to call us, be like, "Hey, we got a workshop or a meeting coming up. Can you help me get the word out?" But as that went through, like Jim said, he got more into the in-depth of planting green, and his story's more into what he was doing and how he could get that information out and how he could expose people to it, and learn more about it at the same time. So yeah, a lot of the stories I've heard, I know, I've heard it from Bill too. It's good to hear that it was something. I remember the day he called me about when William was talking about the planter and putting that well casing on the front and what I thought about it.

It was a neat day. Bill always had those. As it went on, it was something where he worked hard to try and expose everybody to it, but at the same time, he was living it. And I think that's important to his passion for it was definitely something that's inspiring us to continue what he started to.

Yeah. One thing I'll add is that he always wanted to educate everybody, and especially since Mercer County is right on the line with Ohio, that he would always call me and say, "Hey, I want to talk to this group." I think he wanted to talk to a group of Amish, I think. And he said, "Hey, can you come help me talk to this group?" He always was looking to talk to somebody to say, "Hey, I think we can make some inroads with these people here or these people over here." And he always was trying to, like you guys said, go next step further and try something new, like trying some crazy contraptions. And I know he and I did a lot of presentations together. And one of the things he always had, he had a video. I think he had a very hard rain at his place and he showed the rain, the runoff coming off his fields and how the water was just crystal clear.

And then he went to the neighbors where they were doing heavy tillage and he goes there and the water was as brown as brown could be. And he showed that see, there's very little to no soil going off of his farm. And yeah, he was always willing to share the good stuff. And also some of the stuff that he probably would tell you he could have done differently, like all no-till advocates, we always go through a learning process. And of course he was no different there. And he's always willing to say what issues he come across, and how the rest of us can learn from it. And he was always very good advocate for that.

I'm curious, who or what was Bill's motivations for getting involved? When did he start with cover crops and no-till in the first place, and what got him sent down that path?

Oh, do you want me to get started? Well, it was an interesting journey. I mean, when Bill was asked to be one of the committee to start up the No-Till Alliance, he just had a lot of energy. And I remember of him saying to me later on in the development of the No-Till Alliance, he said, "If I wouldn't have met you fellas," he said, "I'm not sure what I would've done." So hats off to all the No-Till board and all the folks that he talked to, I think it was a breath of fresh air for him that he actually had someone that he could relate to in that field.

And I was remembering here, too, that it was only about two years before his passing, [inaudible 00:15:16] he hosted the summer field day there at his farm, and that was just a really good event. Secretary Redding was there that day, and I think we presented several awards that day for pioneers in the soil health movement.

And Bill was one of those recipients. And so also, I guess maybe William or Jay could speak to this, but I think the No-Till Alliance was awarded or given a donation in Bill's memory here by the Mercer County Conservation District. Could someone speak to that?

Yeah, Bill's passing, but it was something that the board recognized and us as staff, me and Nick, and whoever got to know Bill that worked with agriculture. And we felt the No-Till Alliance was something he was passionate in and supporting that to provide a donation to them. We'd always tried to sponsor because of Bill. In some ways, whatever activity was going on, he really didn't ask for it. We'd just say, "Hey, can we give you a sponsorship for whatever activity was local?" And we wanted to keep that up and it was something that that wasn't the last thing. And William and Jim, we will continue to support the No-Till Alliance as much as we can, so keep up the good work and definitely something we want to keep working with you guys, and that's because of Bill and what he exposed Nick and I to, and that passion for that.

Yeah, thank you for that, Jay. I would just say that Bill would talk very positive, and always was very encouraged by the Mercer County Conservation District support to him and to the Alliance. So I think that's a mutual fact there.

One thing I'll add is, you guys kind of touched on it was that, I guess it was last winter, the Mercer Conservation District, you guys had an awards dinner and you guys donated, I think it was $200 to the No-Till Alliance in memory of Bill. And that was very much appreciated because especially what Bill meant to the Pennsylvania No-Till Alliance. And that was very much appreciated by you guys. And another thing I'll add is that if Bill was on this call right now and he told you about his soil health journey, he would mention a guy by the name of Myron Weir, which I'm sure Nick and Jay, you guys probably know who I'm talking about, that he was a friend of his that was just over the line in Ohio. And I guess he and Bill were, I think, maybe close as younger adults or maybe even kids, I think.

Maybe they were in 4-H together or something like that, but they always kind of shared information back and forth and they were good friends. I actually got to meet Myron a year or two ago, and those two were always going back and forth on information and helping each other out. If one of them needed somebody to come talk about their soil health journey, the other would help out and everything. So yes, if Bill was on this call, he definitely would mention his buddy Myron, that's for sure.

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I'm curious, each of you, you have different roles or responsibilities, whether it's with the district or the No-Till Alliance or even, William, on your own farm. How do you see pieces of what Bill preached or taught you guys coming up in your day-to-day work, whatever it may be?

I mean, if anything, I think Bill would be happy to know that we seem to be getting more conferences, more people talking about no-till. And some of the programs I work with where there's some cost share programs, money back for no-till equipment every year, paperwork on my end seems to increase because more people are trying to get a no-till drill, get a no-till planter, get a roller crimper. [inaudible 00:20:56] we have programs that cost share on cover crops and we have to set money aside just for that, but we know we're going to spend it. I think he would be pleased to see that. And just for him, personally, on his end, his grandson, Tom, was an intern here and his grandson, Sam, who's been helping out [inaudible 00:21:23] at Bill's farm is on our district, it's called ACAP, it's a program in Pennsylvania for helping put in conservation practices. He's on that committee to help review applications and help us decide what projects we're going to fund.

I guess with Bill, no matter what, even if the weather wasn't looking great or everything, he always had that positive attitude with it because he's seen a lot of things, and been through a lot of things with his farm. And he always had a positive attitude about things and that, to keep the course and keep doing what you're doing because it's going to get better year after year. And he was the first one to tell you that his soils were much more resilient than they were years ago and things like that. And so he always had a positive outlook on it and to say that next year is going to be better or his organic matter is increasing, so his soil is a lot better. He physically would see his soil getting a lot better. And so he always was looking ahead. He learned from the past, but he was always looking straight ahead. And that was one thing I always admired about him.

I think one thing, a memory or something that I remind myself of in the years that I knew Bill was, or one thing that he taught me was, not to complain. He was a gentleman that it didn't matter how bad things were in the last years that he was struggling there with some health issues, he would never, ever complain. I would call him up just to see how he's doing, and it would be always, "I'm doing all right." And there was times I had the pause and just says, "Bill, I'm glad to hear that, but really I want to know how you're feeling." And then he would open up, but he was not a complainer. I always remember Bill as always looking on the bright side of the situation, and he was just that kind of encouragement to me.

With Bill, there's been farmers that, like Nick was talking to, come into our office that maybe we didn't think we'd see very often, and it was that hope of Bill to get some of those farmers in to talk to us and maybe talk more about soil health or cover crops or something, and that's happened. So he would be very happy to hear that those conversations are being had maybe by somebody that he thought maybe he could influence, but yeah, definitely. And that Nick and I were talking, Nick could speak a little bit more to this, but some of our young farmers in the county that he's inspired and we felt... And William, we met you because of Bill. Even though you're a county over, it's still been a great thing to see, and work with you and expose to what you're doing on your farm. So I think without Bill, we wouldn't have that. And that's something that is important to us and those young farmers that he influenced as well.

Yeah. And to Jay's point, and for a little shameless promotion, next year's PA No-Till Alliance winter meeting on the western part of the state will be held here in Mercer County, Pennsylvania, expecting January 26th of 2027. But during that meeting, one thing we usually do during those meetings is have a farmer panel. And I was talking to William and Jim yesterday at the PA No-Till Alliance meeting, and we are going to have a youth farmer panel, farmers that are in their 30s, and hopefully, I still got to make the connections, but two of those farmers, one of them's going to be one of Bill's grandsons. And the other farmer, he has full-time jobs in his 30s, was always interested about no-till. And we got him connected with Bill, and he transitioned in about the last five years, helped talk his dad into doing this, and he's having great success on fields that he never thought he could farm, and we're hoping to have him as a speaker, he can definitely relate to Bill.

That was just Bill wanting to talk to people about the transition and give them some of his knowledge that he has, his knowledge, his successes, his failures, suggestions. And yeah, it's happened. People have come in our office because of Bill and have transitioned their farm and have nothing but great things to say about how their operation's going. It's impressive.

Well, yeah, I mean, it seems like he is certainly going to continue to have an impact on everybody who interacted with him and on the Pennsylvania agriculture, but probably on a bigger scale than even that as well. So I guess to wrap up, is there anything we haven't discussed yet that anybody wanted to add or any closing comments?

William kind of stole my thunder a little bit earlier when he was talking about him taking videos. I'll always remember that about Bill. You'd never seen somebody more happy than when we had a three-inch rain because he'd come in, he'd come to myself and Jay and he'd have videos, and he'd have a mason jar. He'd drive around with a mason jar full of clean water that he would collect off his fields. And who knows how many people he showed that mason jar, clean water. People thought he was probably driving around with some moonshine, [inaudible 00:28:16] Bill, he wouldn't be moonshine, but he would have that mason jar of clear water and he'd have videos of the runoff coming off his field. [inaudible 00:28:25] go on the side of the road and it would be ditches full of [inaudible 00:28:29] that run off of his property.

I'll always remember that about Bill coming in and just always so excited. "Look at this. Look how well my fields are doing." And yeah, that always put a smile on my face. And I put my smile on my face yesterday when I was thinking about joining for this interview today when I was just writing down some notes. Yeah, there's a lot to be missed about that man, but he's definitely has a legacy in Mercer County, but maybe hopefully across the state and the region.

I guess one last thing I'll say about Bill is that he did a lot of this transition to no-till on his farm relatively later in life. And you would think transitioning, it would be something for a younger guy to do. I'm in my low 30s right now, you'd say, "Oh, a prime age should do some transition, do something like that." Well, Bill did it later in life, and I give him a lot of credit for that because people his age would say, "No way I'm going to do it the way I want to do it for the rest of my life." And he said to himself, "No, there's a better way to do this" And I give him a ton of credit for that because I don't know very many people at his age that would've done something like that and taking that kind of risk and decide to do that.

And so that's one thing I'll always remember because I have a lot of farmers come up to me and say, "Well, I don't know if I want to do this at this point in my life." I'll just point somebody like Bill and say, "This guy did it and he had great success at it, and he loved doing it." And so that's something that'll always stick with me.

Yeah. We were out on his farm one time and he was showing me some of his cover crops in his fields and we were just talking and he said, "I don't have the best yields in the county. My fields don't always look the best." But he said, "Usually at the end of the year, I make a profit." And he said, "That's something that I can look at." And it was just that aspect of it, that you don't have to be the best, it's about what the inputs are and the outputs. And that meant a lot to him and trying to get that message to other people that it's not about how your farm looks sometimes. It's about what you do and what you're trying to make improvements on it. And William, you're right. Later in life, that was something that he was able to get there through that, even though he didn't have as long as some people maybe to work through those.

But yeah, definitely. And Nick's story about the jars and the videos, it was always something he was showing off what he had, which was great.

I think there's two. There's one thing I would want to say in closing here about Bill is that I remember him saying, you never know who is watching. And so I think that can be a message for all of us. You might not think that your neighbor is paying attention to maybe some way out, far out stuff that you're doing in your field, but there's somebody that's watching and hopefully someone will learn and take something good from watching your good soil health conservation practices.

Yeah, well said. Well, just want to thank you guys all for sharing some memories and for chatting, taking time today.

Thank you, Mackane.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

That's it for this episode of the No Till Farmer Podcast. Thanks to Jim Hershey, William Thiele, Nick Trivelli, and Jay Russell for joining us and for sharing their memories about Bill Cannon. You can find a transcript of this episode, as well as our archive of previous episodes at notillfarmer.com. For our entire staff here at No Till Farmer, I'm Mackane Vogel. Thanks for listening. Keep on no-tilling and have a great day.