Get Full Site Access!

Register! Get a FREE downloadable report
from No-Till Farmer!


Download MP3s!

Download audiofiles of presentations from the 18th NNTC in Des Moines!
Learn more.


Subscribe today!

Get the "meat and potatoes" no-till tips and ideas that only No-Till Farmer can provide.

U.S. and North America

1 yr - $44.95

2 yr - $69.95

3 yr - $99.95

Subscribe now!

Cover Crops

Red Clover
Post At
11/11/2008 - 3:25 pm
Post a reply  
reply from
David Brosseau
I'm trying something new for next year. I've seeded red clover in my wheat field last winter, and let it grow all summer. This fall, I've performed a burndown, and will no till corn next spring.
From what I've researched, legumes (red clover) provide nitrogen for the following crop, especially when has not been tilled into the soil.

Is anyone currently doing this? What has been the success rate?
Reply at
11/12/2008 - 2:38 pm
Post a reply  
reply from
Joel Suderman
Coincidence? Providence? I was just thinking about this very thing. Yesterday I asked a seed supplier what he'd recommend as an N-fixing cover crop. He recommended red clover broadcast in late winter (so there would still be some freeze/thaw action to work the seed into the ground). I asked if there was a danger it would grow too tall and interfere with wheat harvest, and he said only if the wheat stand is thin. I guess I would rather do it early rather than wait till after harvest due to concerns about adequate moisture in mid summer. Also, I want to plant corn about mid April, so I wouldn't have as much time for spring growth the following year before a burndown.

David, did you burn down now to control volunteer wheat and prevent a green bridge for mites to neighboring wheat fields? Or why not let it go until next spring and burn down several weeks ahead of planting?

Would the same thing work with hairy vetch? In order to let it (clover or vetch) grow through the winter, would it be advisable to spray with some sort of grass herbicide in early September to kill any volunteer wheat and prevent the green bridge effect? BTW, my location is central Kansas.

Scott or David, did you have any problems planting through the residue? Do you use row cleaners?
Reply at
11/13/2008 - 9:31 am
Post a reply  
reply from
Brian Sneeringer
We have several growers using clover (red or crimson) as a cover crop. They are planting into wheat stubble or corn silage stubble in the fall/late summer. The clovers are then burned down in the following spring prior to corn planting. Are they getting additional N from the clover? YES. How much? A little harder to answer. We are probably getting between 40 and 80 lbs of Nitrogen. A couple of things "here" (South Central PA), a cover crop growing in the spring is preferred in order to "grow out" the excess moisture we have. We have folks planting into the cover live or crispy dead. Neither has experienced any real problems into the clover. In fact, we've had only positve responses to planting into it. The issue this past spring was moisture. For those that killed w/ RU well ahead of planting (7-10 days), rains after kill severly hampered the ability for the soil to dry out for planting. That dead residue really held the moisture and planting was severly delayed. I've encouraged most to consider spraying at planting or using gramoxone for a quicker kill and a smaller window for weather to cause problems. All are very happy with the results of cover crops in general and specifically clover has become the species of choice for fields going into corn. I fully expect cover cropping to become a necessity "here" to making no-till work.
Reply at
11/14/2008 - 3:04 pm
Post a reply  
reply from
David Brosseau
Hello Joel,
to respond to your question, the reason I burned down the clover in the fall, I was worried about a wet spring. My concern was that if I was delayed in the spring to do my burndown, and the clover really took hold and started to grow, would I have a harder time killing it? That was mainly my primary worry.
We used a Roundup/ 2-4-D mix to kill it. It did a great job, and entire stand is crispy. My research tell me it'll hold its Nitrogen, living or dead.

I still spread Potash this fall, maybe I really didn't need to.

Brian,
with regards to your post, we have the same issue in SW Ontario Canada, with a wet spring. If the clover really starts to grow, do you find a tougher time killing it in the spring?

Thanks for the responses everyone, much appreciated. South Western Ontario climate seems very similar Ohio's probably a little milder. We're in the 3200 heat unit range, with clay loam soils.

Reply at
11/17/2008 - 11:22 am
Post a reply  
reply from
Brian Sneeringer
So far a 2.4D and roundup mix or gramoxone has killed the clover. Well, let me clarify that a little, no one has complained that they didn't get a good kill with these products. I haven't been in contact with every single farmer that has used clover cover crops, but, I am pretty sure I'd have heard if they didn't kill it! An active healthy plant should take in the herbicide of choice very well. Don't beleive it? Just try it on a small field or a portion of the field OR grow some RR corn and experiment in that. At least with the RR corn you can spray again if you don't kill it. Farmers here have voiced the same concern you have and it appears to be an unfounded fear. I've ssen some very healthy and very tall clover (18") get sprayed and corn no-tilled with no clover regrowth (or at least any that caused a problem). The resdiue that it puts down and the moisture that can be retained is really, really incredible. However, the only way to be convinced though is to do it yourself.
Reply at
11/24/2008 - 12:11 pm
Post a reply  
reply from
David Brosseau
I wanted to make an addition to this discussion. Speaking with an agronomist this week, he was concerned about slugs in the red clover eating my corn once it's planted.
Has anyone encountered this issue? I haven't seen any talk of this in my research.
Reply at
12/ 1/2008 - 12:47 pm
Post a reply  
reply from
Brian Sneeringer
I've seen/heard of slug problems in varying no-till situations with and without cover crops. Certainly the residue from cover crops make a good habitat for slugs and they will most likely be a problem for you from time to time. No one has come up with a really good, cost effective way to deal with them that I've heard about. On top of that they always seems to hit a field or section of field that is visable from the road! No one here that I know of has seen/experienced a bad enough slug problem to scrap the whole notion of no-till and cover crops yet. Expect them and adjust your system if they become a problem.
Reply at
12/13/2008 - 12:03 pm
Post a reply  
reply from
Ed Winkle
Interesting thread! Thanks all for the good discussion! For some reason I am not troubled by slugs and I think it is just dry enough here to help the situation. But I really think healthy soil has a lot to do with it along with timely planting, harvesting, scouting and pest management.

As far as southern Ohio is David we can plant 107 day corn and expect good dry down almost every time regardless of planting date which was late this year. I prefer the rugged 112 day hybrids that yield more but they also bring more water to the bin to deal with. I have planted 118 day corn with great yields but again the moisture content. Beans, 3.5-3.7 is early and best yields from 4.0-4.5.

Ed
Reply at
09/13/2009 - 8:03 pm
Post a reply  
reply from
Loren Behrman
For more information regarding Red and Crimson Clover go to: "www.oregonclover.org"
  

Login to post to the forum
© 2009. Lessiter Publications and No-Till Farmer. 225 Regency Court, Suite 200, Brookfield, WI, 53045. PHONE: (262) 782-1252, E-MAIL: info@no-tillfarmer.com Privacy policy.